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2 years ago
Vigil Fan, to answer your question, he obviously coached Jim Ryun who is without a doubt a world class athlete. |
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2 years ago
Vigil Fan, to answer your question, he obviously coached Jim Ryun who was with out a doubt a world class athlete. |
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2 years ago
On the vigil daniels argument, great coaching never should mean having the fastest runner or world class athlete. That is unfair way of measuring. Fair would be duplicate of the same runner, one training with one coach. Great coaches take runners and help them become better. No matter how good the coach it takes a combo of runner-coach to be the best. Comparing coaches by which athletes "they" have produced goes nowhere. |
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3 years ago
Interesting comment about the women runners who didn't need to run more than 30mpw. Is that possible for a runner (male or female) whose race distance is 10k? Did he coach any NCAA xc champ males who ran 30-40mpw? |
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3 years ago
Hits the nail on the head every time. |
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3 years ago
He may not have the most credentials that many other coachs have like the most all americans or most conference championships or something like that but yes he is credited for his knowledge and how to taylor it to certain runners or programs. What you could say though is that he is probably the best coach of coachs because many coachs come to him and use what he has discovered to help their own runners. |
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3 years ago
Daniel's coached a great women's team in the 80s and 90s at Cortland; his teams dominated the DIII national scene for over a decade. He knows his coaching and has shown with his teams' successes. |
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3 years ago
Vigil fan, he knows more than you ever will, so stop replying.My question and claims have had NOTHING to do with a lack of knowledge by Daniels. So I'm confused at what you're getting at. He may know more about running than anyone in the world. That doesn't make him the worlds or even America's greatest coach. That may make him capable of being the best but he has to actually do it and prove it to get that title. I'm just trying to have some discussion on something that a lot of people talk about outside of the bandwagon. I don't have anything against Daniels. He's great for the sport. I just think the claims others make about his coaching (not knowledge) are overrated. I'm still waiting on someone to aswer my question. I've been asking it for years for someone to tell me what world class athletes he's coached and no one has an aswer. Maybe Flotrack can ask that question? Not bashing, just asking for an answer. |
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3 years ago
Vigil fan, he knows more than you ever will, so stop replying. |
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3 years ago
JD is considered a guru because although much of what he continues to say does not sound novel now, it was when he first said it, decades agoI have to disagree. Daniel's was not groundbreaking in his ideas or approach at any time. He was groundbreaking in his presentation. There are many writings much older than Daniel's that explain training just as well with simular if not the same ideas. So what he did well which gained him fame was how his writings do not take a highly educated background to read. How he explains training very simply and therefore his writings have been very successful. Go read Coe's work and you need more pre-book knowledge to understand it. So again I say Daniel's greatest role is as adisor and author which is still important and of great value. |
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3 years ago
I just read an article (today) from Jason Karp (PhD) in the latest "techniques" magazine (USTFCCCA publication) addressing this very issue. I am completely paraphrazing and summarizing, BUT Dr. Karp asks the question "How much mileage is enough?" It essentially covers all the arguments for and against higher mileage training, but emphasizes that it is WIDELY agreed that there is not a magic forumla for mileage and success. Many runners who run well off of low mileage "may" do so, because it is at higher intensity or (quality) and those that run well off of higher mileage, may do so because they have become better economically due to the daily repetition of miles each week (quantity). However, the genetic traits of each person have to be factored in as well. As the article also clearly states (and I think is relatively true to a large extent for all runners), "A runner with a lot of talent will almost always outperform a runner with little talent and a lot of training"...IF all things like committment, motivation, focus, etc, are equal. If you can find a copy of the article, then I suggest reading it. It was interesting. |
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3 years ago
JD is considered a guru because although much of what he continues to say does not sound novel now, it was when he first said it, decades ago |
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3 years ago
People that want him as there coach are runners who can't handle real mileage or training. These plans will never advance you to the elite level, because workouts are far too easy...anyone that uses these plans and is successful is doing so off pure talent and could be better. If the sport were as easy as a bunch of charts and simple formulas everyone would be great. |
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3 years ago
I want this guy as my coach, wow |
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3 years ago
THIS GUY IS SO RIGHT... |
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3 years ago
He's also been there to advise my elites."He's also been there to advise my elites" was supposed to say "...MANY elite". sorry for the typo |
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3 years ago
What Jack Daniels says here is correct about how to structure and individualize training. So my comments below are not about any disagreement with that. What I do question is why is Daniels considered the great guru or the greatest coach? I don't get it. I remember being at a clinic in Flagstaff several years ago where both Daniels and Vigil were speaking. To be clear I think the world of Vigil. Vigil was speaking about his training and someone made the comment that "Well, Daniel's say's this". Vigil responded with "who has Daniel's actually coached". Daniel's is a great advistor and author. His cookie cutter plans in his books have helped a lot of high school coaches and bad college coaches get by. He's also been there to advise my elites. Now I'm not saying he couldn't be a great coach but someone please tell me about all the world class athletes he's coached?? He didn't coach Kennedy or Cullpepper but he puts them on the cover of his books. I see Daniels and I see a guy who knows his text book knowledge. He's truly a positive for the sport. However, I see a guy who has self promoted his way to the title "greatest coach". I'm really not trying to down him so I'm sorry if I have offended Daniel's fans. I just think the title he's given as "greatest" are a disrespect to the actual great coaches in this country who are actually coaching elite athletes regularlly. |
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3 years ago
I have the utmost respect for JD. He is probably the most influential being in the modern era of distance running, and he really knows and cares about running and people in general. It's amazing to me how many coaches and athletes just don't get it even after perfectly clear explanations. Anyone who doesn't at least consider what JD has to say is a fool. Just my little rant. |
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3 years ago
seeing this just makes me feel more fortunent that i have the coach i have. First he cares about every body (this coming from the like tenth man on cross) and second he real does know what he is doing and why he does it. thanks strom |
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3 years ago
this is why i love workout Wednesdays...when asked why the runners are doing blah blah workout, the coach gives specific reasons why PLUS knows when someone has had enough for the day. |
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3 years ago
One thing he didn't touch on that he's written, but is related, is that certain runners should run 100 mpw, while others should run 60. Training programs should be tailored to individual runners. Physiologically, some runners benefit from and might even need high mileage at a slower relative pace. Other runners, for example Bernard Lagat, focus on less mileage at a higher relative pace. A good coach will identify what works for the individual and tailors a training program to maximize their response to the induced stress. |
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3 years ago
If only my high school coach would watch this |
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3 years ago
i wish he was my coach! |
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3 years ago
sadly enough I see coaches who think they know what their doing all the time but in reality they don't. most of the time its little things like if you want to run faster then you have to go fast everyday and run longer than what you did the day before, or give their athletes little to no rest after a repetition. but best part about it is when you say something to them they get very offensive and attack you like you have no idea what you are talking about. the best type of coach is one who is open minded.I agree your assessment of coaches who may be set in their ways, but the athletes have to have an open mind as well. I've worked with several athletes who said, "well this is the way we did it in high school", so this is the only way to do it. OR "my high school coach said I should do this way or that way"...they problem is, they're not with that coach any longer and must be willing to adjust themselves. More than likely, they will find themselves reaching new heights they didn't in high school. But again, they should ask questions, respectfully, if the coach doesn't explain why they are doing a particular workout. |
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3 years ago
One of the smartest Coaches EVER...nough said. |
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3 years ago
time + patience = athletic potential |
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3 years ago
When JD says start young, what age is he thinking about and is it the same age for boys and girls? |
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3 years ago
I don't know how many times I burned out in high school (well, I do, it's like 4 times) trying to train like I'm a professional runner! |
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3 years ago
he's right on the money talking about how some runners can handle higher mileage then others. I don't know how many times I've seen High School coaches burn runners out, trying to train them like they're professional runners. |
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3 years ago
sadly enough I see coaches who think they know what their doing all the time but in reality they don't. most of the time its little things like if you want to run faster then you have to go fast everyday and run longer than what you did the day before, or give their athletes little to no rest after a repetition. but best part about it is when you say something to them they get very offensive and attack you like you have no idea what you are talking about. the best type of coach is one who is open minded. |
