I just heard that Sammy Sosa had tested positive for drugs a few years ago so again this becomes pointed. I agree with Dan that it is great to see that the USATF is listening to it's members and doing something to help the athletes perform their best without chancing a positive drug test. Regarding testing, the athletes are not tested daily but are required to allot a specific time and place each day where the testers can find them for testing if required. It seems they are tested more or less weekly but not on a regular schedule and are responsible for completely random testing at any time, day or night, as well.
I think I just heard that the USATF started taking some action that seems to be directly influenced by Shannon Rowbury's remark. When I first saw this video her point made so much sense. I'm glad to see that the USATF is actually taking it seriously.
As for Mark's comment below, I never realized that they had to be tested everyday. Wow...
Shannon is correct, nutritional supplements are neither regulated nor tested. A manufacturer could list specific ingredients and rigorously test for quality and then seek USADA approval but it would be a very expensive process, probably prohibitively so. And since the market for such high cost supplements would be small it is unlikely that any company would attempt it. Unless a large pharmaceutical company could see the public relations value in it. They would already have the facilities and capabilities to produce verifiable and clean supplements.
There are a lot of people that ask us to stop the comments bc of negative comments but my theory is that there always going to be haters out there and they will always find a way to hate. So what we have tried to do is create a positive culture on our site and I think for the most part we have kept the haters at bay so to Darren and Shannon there are a couple haters out there and don't take much into what they say. You guys are rocking and rolling and keep it up we are all proud of you.
As for what Shannon said, I think she is 100% right. I mean these athletes are basically on call at all times. Life is unpredictable and that is what makes it fun, but Shannon has to constantly be worried about a missed test and have an hour a day set aside. No spontaneous drive to the beach or staying over at your friends house bc your too tired to make it home. I would love to be a great runner competing at the Olympics but 80% of the time I don't envy what they have to go through day to day.
I also agree with Shannon that the athletes should get some help. Its like USADA and WADA are putting all the risk on the athlete and taking none for themselves. I mean how hard would it be for the USADA to start a list going of supplements that are approved? It might be great branding for the drug companies.
Now to Darren's point I respect his opinion, but I do think it is flawed. In theory you are right, the public out cry would deter people to take drugs even if it were legal, but I think we would be in the same situation. Even thought it would be legal to take drugs people would try to hide that they were taking it bc of the humiliation. We would still have people trying to get around the system.
Shannon pretty well summed it up so I won't continue. Except that something as simple as Gatorade is a supplement although you may not have considered it and if you have taken a cold or allergy tablet there is a good chance you have taken a banned substance. That is not such a problem for regular people but for an athlete (College as well as Pro), it is not as simple as running down to the 7-11 for an energy drink and a package of cold tablets. Everything an athlete ingests must be considered. The carrots are probably okay but what is in that SoBe? About cross contamination. If you look at the vitamin rack at any pharmacy of supermarket you will find supplements from A to Z from many manufacturers. The supplements are produced in the same large vats in the same factory and you are depending on the cleaning crew to remove the residues from the preceding batch. If something is missed there may be a little Z in your A and there goes your positive for a banned substance. It is a matter of finding a lab that doesn't process banned substances or one that is willing to prove and guarantee it's cleanliness. G
We are proud of you for having the courage and strength to share your voice and speak your mind on this topic. Hopefully your comments will spark more and more athletes to come forward and petition the USADA to find a solution to this problem.
We know that all of your success has only come through very hard work, dedication and great coaching.
As your parents, it is very hard to read the horrible comments and accusations that anonymous strangers have written about you. Clearly, they don't know anything about your ethics or morals but your family and friends know the truth.
Keep fighting the good fight!!
XO
Mom and Dad
Thanks Darren for your post. I also wanted to take a moment to state my thoughts on this topic more clearly and to give some background for why I feel this way.
As a professional athlete, I am required to submit a list of my whereabouts on a quarterly basis. That means I have to tell USADA and WADA where I will be training and sleeping each day, as well as set aside an 1 hour testing period/location each day where I must be ready and waiting should they choose to test me. If I travel, I have to send them an update. If I stay at a friends house, I have to send them an update. If I don't, and they come to test me, I have missed a test.
I am all for this. USADA made the drug testing rules and regulations much stricter as of January 1, 2009, and I am happy to comply. I am proud to be competing for a country that is committed to keeping the Olympic sports clean, and I am glad that USADA has added new protocol to ensure that this is the case. As I have said to people before, I don't want to be in this sport if I can't complete clean. I care about my future, my potential children's futures, and most importantly, I want to make my friends, family, and country proud.
That being said, when I went through the 4 hour USADA online tutorial in December informing me of all the new things expected of me as an athlete, I was frustrated by one key element. USADA states that they do not support the use of any nutritional supplements, and that any use of such products is done at the athlete’s own risk. To me, this seems completely short sighted.
I can think of few runners (if any) who don’t take some from of supplementation, even if it is as simple as a daily multi-vitamin. The biggest fear for most athletes is that they might take a product they think is safe, and later find out it was cross contaminated in a unclean lab. I will not shop at places like GNC, because they can make no guarantee that the harmless multi-vitamin on their shelf wasn't produced in a vat that once held a banned stimulant. I check all of my over the counter drugs on the USADA Drug Reference Online (DRO) to make sure they are safe (ex: Aleve=ok, Midol= bad). But I do not understand why USADA will test name brand pharmaceuticals such as Aleve, Motrin, and Claritin, and yet they won't offer us any sort of advice on what multi-vitamin or amino acid is the most pure.
Case in point: When I went to take Midol for my cramps (yes...the joys of being a woman), I looked up the product on the USADA DRO. Apparently there are 4 products on the market. Two are safe: Midol® Maximum Strength Cramp Formula & Midol® PM. 2 contain a banned substance: Midol® Maximum Strength Teen Formula & Midol® PMS Maximum Strength. Even with this knowledge I still found it hard to differentiate between what was safe and what wasn't, since the labeling on the box doesn't match exactly with the product on the shelf and, clearly, there are banned substances sharing the same factory. And so, I went with Aleve, which passed all tests in all forms with flying colors.
But with supplements the situation becomes much more tricky. For a full statement of USADAs stance, visit the Drug Reference Online - Dietary Supplements. Highlighted below are a few reasons why I feel as I do.
USADA admits that it is hard to be sure about the quality, even of a multi-vitamin:
-"Supplements do not appear in DRO™ because USADA is not able to provide a definitive answer as to the status of each product. This is due to a variety of reasons, but primarily to limitations in the regulation and ongoing quality control over dietary supplement labeling, purity and many of their ingredients (see DHSEA, below)."
-"The Dietary Supplement Health and Education Act (DSHEA) of 1994 specifically exempted vitamins, minerals, amino acids, herbs and botanicals, and their extracts and concentrates from evaluation for safety and efficacy by the Food and Drug Administration (FDA).
-"There is evidence that some products may not contain the ingredients listed on the label in the stated amount, may not contain the ingredients listed at all, or may be contaminated or adulterated with other prohibited substances not listed on the label."
As an athlete training for 4-6 hours a day (or racing in every other day at US Champs), I cannot possibly rely on my sleep, my faith, and my food alone to help my body fully recover so that I can lace up my shoes and function at a high quality the next day. And so, I take vitamins. Rather than making a blanket statement that essentially leaves us (the athletes) to try to makes sense of the hundreds of products out there on our own or spend thousands to test our vitamins independently, why doesn’t USADA instead use it’s resources to find 1 or 2 safe companies for the athletes to use? All I ask is that USADA help me in my quest for clean records and a clean sport.
And here comes the inevitable. Hey Yall, I knew after what I said, I was going to be bashed on here in the comments section and at first, I wasn't going to respond, but I believe that a few things need to be cleared up ...
First, we were asked a question of opinion by a panel and I felt it our obligation after how well they treated us there to give them a straight forward, honest answer. What I gave was an opinion, I didn't say it was the flawless cure to an epidemic in our sport and others. To be honest, I don't know what the "perfect" answer is, but I know we haven't found it yet. What I hoped to get across through my statement was that there needs to be a radical change of some kind. I welcome ideas like the one posted that suggests the other panelists and I be tested weekly. Lets test everyone weekly! I would gladly accept that invitation in order to prove that any future success I have came from pure hard work. What I meant by making everything legal and making people declare what they take was not that I believe we should be taking substances (I believe the exact opposite ... we shouldn't take anything!) but rather that hopefully the humiliation and fallout of support/fans that would come from that declaration would be deterrent enough to stop people from doing it. Maybe it wont, maybe people will find more ways around it, but that was my idea. I believe that this grants good grounding for a "one-and-done" policy, of which I used to be a huge fan of anyways. I only became skeptical of it because I had a roommate who, in college, ate a box of poppy-seed muffins and tested positive for opiates. This kid was so straight-laced and clean, that it was actually funny that he got this result. It proved to me that false positives are possible and helped me to try and maintain an optimistic approach this topic. Maybe this cleared some of my thinking up, maybe it didn't and yall still think I'm an idiot, but I was simply trying to give my honest opinion as was everyone else in the panel (of whom I have tremendous respect for).
So the final two things I will say are 1. Trey was my roommate in college for 2 years. I do in fact currently live on a couch thanks to the generosity of an amazing friend and ex-teammate. THANK YOU! 2. Lets try not to be so negative/harsh on here folks. It puts an ugly cloud over our sport and does the opposite of what I am sure all of us want to do (promote the sport) by driving people away from the ignorance and abuse that is given. Lets try to support each other and then we can expect to get support from outside our sports arena.
Thanks yall and all the best.
dbrown
Please re-listen closely to what Shannon said. She's talking about supplements NOT steroids and she's suggesting that it would be helpful if the USADA and/or WADA would endorse supplement companies so athletes can be reassured that any supplement they are taking isn't contaminated.
Now, go ask any professional and/or elite athlete if they take supplements. Yes, even those that believe in God.
You are totally misrepresenting and misunderstanding the message here
Finally, go to the USADA website and see for yourself the number of times these athletes are drug tested. I think you will be surprised.
Darren and Shannon need to be tested once every month for the next year. When you are a professional runner, it's your job to take the time to figure out whether the stuff you are taking is legal or not. Why would they even be taking anything that could possibly have a hint of something illegal? If you're sore take an ice bath. If you need more energy, eat some more healthy foods or change up your training. You don't need to take stuff that could be close to being illegal. If you are pushing it to the furthest point possible to get that slight edge that the runner next to you doesn't have, do some serious sole searching. Or believe what Rankin and Hall believe in. Believe that God gave you all the ability that you need. If you're not religious, believe that some big bang gave you the ability.
I completely agree with what Darren, Jon, and Shannon said. I would also stand up for Darren and I understand where he is coming from. If people are going to cheat whether or not these drugs are legal, what's the point? It's like having a national drinking age of 21 years old. People are always going to break the law, cheat, etc. to get ahead. My issue is that those illegal actions will forever tarnish and question the performance of all those that are playing by the rules from this point forward; it's not right, it's not fair, and I commend the efforts of the USA distance athletes out there doing their best to play by the rules. You are all an inspiration to me and the country you represent, thank you!
I am pretty sure Rowbury is telling what a lot of us regular athletes don't see. That they have to be wary of anything they take even multivitamins because if a substance containing HGH is manufactured in the same facility as a multivitamin it could be cross contaminated and they would get unjustly bnned and looked down upon. I think she is just saying she would rather the leading agencies on the illegal substances to do the work beforehand and say "okay if you want to take a multivitamin these companies products were clean."
"Brown's not much of a thinker, he is? So you let people take drugs, but they have to ADMIT they're taking drugs? So if a guy wins because he took drugs but he ADMITTED it, it's okay then? But if he took a drug other than the one that he admitted..it's not okay? Oy"
agreed...who decides who can declare what? if they are all legal can you just declare them all? what about hardcore steroids and gene therepy that have potentially dangerous side effects? declaring all drugs legal is definitely not the way to go...the current system isn't perfect but there isn't really an alternative, just DON'T take the drugs...it is that simple-have some personal accountability instead of just saying that they should be legal because the other guy got caught doing it. It's like the teacher catching one student and then giving them an F, kicking them out of the classroom, then another student asking the teacher if they are allowed to cheat from now on.
What Rankin (and Rowbury) said makes a lot of sense...darren brown not as much
Anonymous Coward said: “Dude....Darren Brown.
What an idiot.
"Make them all legal..."
Yeah, and while we're at it, let's just go ahead and wipe out impressive times/records set by clean athletes like Billy Mills, Steve Prefontaine, Frank Shorter, etc....
Someone kick him in the nuts & give him Barry Bonds' address.”
I wouldn't be so sure that those athletes were clean my friend. Clean by todays standards at least, most modern illegal substances were legal back than.
What are you taking that you don't know if it's legal or not? If you are taking any sketchy supplements you are trying to get an edge obviously. Most people take multivitamins, vitamin c, calcium, etc. I don't think those supplements are laced with HGH but I could be wrong.
I follow your thought process there: Anyone who took a PED would be forced to tell everyone and be judged by that choice, with the hope being that nobody wants that stigma attached to their name. My question is, if we can't stop people from using it now, how can we force them to tell us they're using it then? Testing is only doing so much now and the incentive to hide that you are taking will still be there. It wouldn't necessarily clean up the sport. Also, how do you differentiate between the people that are taking and the people who aren't? A separate national championship? Putting them in the same race would be unfair, but racing them separately would give people a reason to lie. But Darren's idea is an idea...
Brown's not much of a thinker, he is? So you let people take drugs, but they have to ADMIT they're taking drugs? So if a guy wins because he took drugs but he ADMITTED it, it's okay then? But if he took a drug other than the one that he admitted..it's not okay? Oy.
"Make them all legal..."
Yeah, and while we're at it, let's just go ahead and wipe out impressive times/records set by clean athletes like Billy Mills, Steve Prefontaine, Frank Shorter, etc....
Someone kick him in the nuts & give him Barry Bonds' address.
Good for Brown and Rowbury speaking up.
Athletics is being taken over by pharmaceutical corporations, that have nothing to do with athletics.
It's time to put a stop to all the bogus drug tests, and return to pure 100% athletic competitions.
I have to second what Robert said. Whenever someone gets caught they say, "Well I got this prescription, and I didn't know that is had Substance X in it." While most of the time these athletes are undoubtedly lying, it is possible that a small minority were sincerely ignorant to the fact that they were taking illegal substances. I think that if the USATF and USADA would do what appears to be logical and present their athletes the information they need these messes wouldn't happen.
I also just want to state that Rowbury showed a lot of guts making that statement. It's not often that people stand up to those organizations. She should be commended.
What Shannon is talking about is having USADA and the USATF have approved supplements. I think that is the best way to make sure there is no contaminated supplements. USADA and USATF need to help these athletes out. They want so much from them, yet don't do much to support the athlete.
Rowbury - what is she talking about? Wants USATAF to recommenend - creatine - baking soda?? There is a list of banned substances - do not take these or any other questionable substance! How hard can it be?
Make them legal? The guy in the orange shirt must be on drugs during this interview.
I think it should be fairly rigorous testing for only the top 30 or so athletes in the world, and if they are caught with anything illegal, instant ban for life.
With the may that drugs are now if is actually extremely difficult to get caught, and even if you know the right people it is impossible to get caught. Making them all legal is not the best way to solve the problem, but the most ideal way would be to just have everyone be legit. I really don't see that happening anytime soon. When you are looking to get an edge and get an edge fast you turn to drugs to speed up a natural process that just takes a little more time. With the pressure these athletes are under to perform or get dropped, I can understand using drugs to make you run at a peak performance. Does that make it right no, but I would say that making them legal would solve some of the problems. It's not an ideal solution, but lets face it this is a less than ideal situation.
okay, so if everything is legal, than if you want to be good, you have to take drugs....what about the majority of athletes who actually CARE about their body.....To make all drugs legal is possibly the dumbest solution to this problem....
Rashid Ramzi Drug Question
As for Mark's comment below, I never realized that they had to be tested everyday. Wow...
As for what Shannon said, I think she is 100% right. I mean these athletes are basically on call at all times. Life is unpredictable and that is what makes it fun, but Shannon has to constantly be worried about a missed test and have an hour a day set aside. No spontaneous drive to the beach or staying over at your friends house bc your too tired to make it home. I would love to be a great runner competing at the Olympics but 80% of the time I don't envy what they have to go through day to day.
I also agree with Shannon that the athletes should get some help. Its like USADA and WADA are putting all the risk on the athlete and taking none for themselves. I mean how hard would it be for the USADA to start a list going of supplements that are approved? It might be great branding for the drug companies.
Now to Darren's point I respect his opinion, but I do think it is flawed. In theory you are right, the public out cry would deter people to take drugs even if it were legal, but I think we would be in the same situation. Even thought it would be legal to take drugs people would try to hide that they were taking it bc of the humiliation. We would still have people trying to get around the system.
We are proud of you for having the courage and strength to share your voice and speak your mind on this topic. Hopefully your comments will spark more and more athletes to come forward and petition the USADA to find a solution to this problem.
We know that all of your success has only come through very hard work, dedication and great coaching.
As your parents, it is very hard to read the horrible comments and accusations that anonymous strangers have written about you. Clearly, they don't know anything about your ethics or morals but your family and friends know the truth.
Keep fighting the good fight!!
XO
Mom and Dad
As a professional athlete, I am required to submit a list of my whereabouts on a quarterly basis. That means I have to tell USADA and WADA where I will be training and sleeping each day, as well as set aside an 1 hour testing period/location each day where I must be ready and waiting should they choose to test me. If I travel, I have to send them an update. If I stay at a friends house, I have to send them an update. If I don't, and they come to test me, I have missed a test.
I am all for this. USADA made the drug testing rules and regulations much stricter as of January 1, 2009, and I am happy to comply. I am proud to be competing for a country that is committed to keeping the Olympic sports clean, and I am glad that USADA has added new protocol to ensure that this is the case. As I have said to people before, I don't want to be in this sport if I can't complete clean. I care about my future, my potential children's futures, and most importantly, I want to make my friends, family, and country proud.
That being said, when I went through the 4 hour USADA online tutorial in December informing me of all the new things expected of me as an athlete, I was frustrated by one key element. USADA states that they do not support the use of any nutritional supplements, and that any use of such products is done at the athlete’s own risk. To me, this seems completely short sighted.
I can think of few runners (if any) who don’t take some from of supplementation, even if it is as simple as a daily multi-vitamin. The biggest fear for most athletes is that they might take a product they think is safe, and later find out it was cross contaminated in a unclean lab. I will not shop at places like GNC, because they can make no guarantee that the harmless multi-vitamin on their shelf wasn't produced in a vat that once held a banned stimulant. I check all of my over the counter drugs on the USADA Drug Reference Online (DRO) to make sure they are safe (ex: Aleve=ok, Midol= bad). But I do not understand why USADA will test name brand pharmaceuticals such as Aleve, Motrin, and Claritin, and yet they won't offer us any sort of advice on what multi-vitamin or amino acid is the most pure.
Case in point: When I went to take Midol for my cramps (yes...the joys of being a woman), I looked up the product on the USADA DRO. Apparently there are 4 products on the market. Two are safe: Midol® Maximum Strength Cramp Formula & Midol® PM. 2 contain a banned substance: Midol® Maximum Strength Teen Formula & Midol® PMS Maximum Strength. Even with this knowledge I still found it hard to differentiate between what was safe and what wasn't, since the labeling on the box doesn't match exactly with the product on the shelf and, clearly, there are banned substances sharing the same factory. And so, I went with Aleve, which passed all tests in all forms with flying colors.
But with supplements the situation becomes much more tricky. For a full statement of USADAs stance, visit the Drug Reference Online - Dietary Supplements. Highlighted below are a few reasons why I feel as I do.
USADA admits that it is hard to be sure about the quality, even of a multi-vitamin:
-"Supplements do not appear in DRO™ because USADA is not able to provide a definitive answer as to the status of each product. This is due to a variety of reasons, but primarily to limitations in the regulation and ongoing quality control over dietary supplement labeling, purity and many of their ingredients (see DHSEA, below)."
-"The Dietary Supplement Health and Education Act (DSHEA) of 1994 specifically exempted vitamins, minerals, amino acids, herbs and botanicals, and their extracts and concentrates from evaluation for safety and efficacy by the Food and Drug Administration (FDA).
-"There is evidence that some products may not contain the ingredients listed on the label in the stated amount, may not contain the ingredients listed at all, or may be contaminated or adulterated with other prohibited substances not listed on the label."
As an athlete training for 4-6 hours a day (or racing in every other day at US Champs), I cannot possibly rely on my sleep, my faith, and my food alone to help my body fully recover so that I can lace up my shoes and function at a high quality the next day. And so, I take vitamins. Rather than making a blanket statement that essentially leaves us (the athletes) to try to makes sense of the hundreds of products out there on our own or spend thousands to test our vitamins independently, why doesn’t USADA instead use it’s resources to find 1 or 2 safe companies for the athletes to use? All I ask is that USADA help me in my quest for clean records and a clean sport.
First, we were asked a question of opinion by a panel and I felt it our obligation after how well they treated us there to give them a straight forward, honest answer. What I gave was an opinion, I didn't say it was the flawless cure to an epidemic in our sport and others. To be honest, I don't know what the "perfect" answer is, but I know we haven't found it yet. What I hoped to get across through my statement was that there needs to be a radical change of some kind. I welcome ideas like the one posted that suggests the other panelists and I be tested weekly. Lets test everyone weekly! I would gladly accept that invitation in order to prove that any future success I have came from pure hard work. What I meant by making everything legal and making people declare what they take was not that I believe we should be taking substances (I believe the exact opposite ... we shouldn't take anything!) but rather that hopefully the humiliation and fallout of support/fans that would come from that declaration would be deterrent enough to stop people from doing it. Maybe it wont, maybe people will find more ways around it, but that was my idea. I believe that this grants good grounding for a "one-and-done" policy, of which I used to be a huge fan of anyways. I only became skeptical of it because I had a roommate who, in college, ate a box of poppy-seed muffins and tested positive for opiates. This kid was so straight-laced and clean, that it was actually funny that he got this result. It proved to me that false positives are possible and helped me to try and maintain an optimistic approach this topic. Maybe this cleared some of my thinking up, maybe it didn't and yall still think I'm an idiot, but I was simply trying to give my honest opinion as was everyone else in the panel (of whom I have tremendous respect for).
So the final two things I will say are 1. Trey was my roommate in college for 2 years. I do in fact currently live on a couch thanks to the generosity of an amazing friend and ex-teammate. THANK YOU! 2. Lets try not to be so negative/harsh on here folks. It puts an ugly cloud over our sport and does the opposite of what I am sure all of us want to do (promote the sport) by driving people away from the ignorance and abuse that is given. Lets try to support each other and then we can expect to get support from outside our sports arena.
Thanks yall and all the best.
dbrown
Now, go ask any professional and/or elite athlete if they take supplements. Yes, even those that believe in God.
You are totally misrepresenting and misunderstanding the message here
Finally, go to the USADA website and see for yourself the number of times these athletes are drug tested. I think you will be surprised.
Ladies and gentlemen, Darren Brown is on drugs (but its okay because he is going to declare them).
This man holds a college degree?
agreed...who decides who can declare what? if they are all legal can you just declare them all? what about hardcore steroids and gene therepy that have potentially dangerous side effects? declaring all drugs legal is definitely not the way to go...the current system isn't perfect but there isn't really an alternative, just DON'T take the drugs...it is that simple-have some personal accountability instead of just saying that they should be legal because the other guy got caught doing it. It's like the teacher catching one student and then giving them an F, kicking them out of the classroom, then another student asking the teacher if they are allowed to cheat from now on.
What Rankin (and Rowbury) said makes a lot of sense...darren brown not as much
“Dude....Darren Brown.
What an idiot.
"Make them all legal..."
Yeah, and while we're at it, let's just go ahead and wipe out impressive times/records set by clean athletes like Billy Mills, Steve Prefontaine, Frank Shorter, etc....
Someone kick him in the nuts & give him Barry Bonds' address.”
Great Job Man. Hardest working and most dedicated guy out there
What an idiot.
"Make them all legal..."
Yeah, and while we're at it, let's just go ahead and wipe out impressive times/records set by clean athletes like Billy Mills, Steve Prefontaine, Frank Shorter, etc....
Someone kick him in the nuts & give him Barry Bonds' address.
Athletics is being taken over by pharmaceutical corporations, that have nothing to do with athletics.
It's time to put a stop to all the bogus drug tests, and return to pure 100% athletic competitions.
I also just want to state that Rowbury showed a lot of guts making that statement. It's not often that people stand up to those organizations. She should be commended.
I think it should be fairly rigorous testing for only the top 30 or so athletes in the world, and if they are caught with anything illegal, instant ban for life.